Vista
 

Just wondering if anyone is running Vista yet and are you having any issues with Ryzom?

Re: Vista
 

unless 80% of the games i'd like to play REQUIRE DX10 i will never switch, since, aside from the oodles of reasons against Vista, DX10 is the single reason for it. ;)

Re: Vista
 

Check the tech-support forums :)

Re: Vista
 

Yes, it works.

Re: Vista
 

Lol. A PC is far more than a Game console, you know? And no, DX10 is only one more reason to switch to Vista; there are a lot more, and good ones.

Re: Vista
 

I'm with Xenofur on passing on Vista :)

Re: Vista
 

You should look up some articles on Vista's "fine print." It's rather dystopian.

Re: Vista
 

The part about the game console is exactly my point. The only advantage that Vista offers over XP is that it is able to display games that support DX10 better. All the other stuff is either about restricting what you can do with computer or pure eye candy without any merit in a work environment.

This should be moved to off-topic though, methinks.

Re: Vista
 

That stuff about restricting what you can do with your computer, is completely fake information. Give me a verifiable example of a restriction first. A firewall, now THAT's restriction, I say! Yes, the eye candy is a bit too much, but when enabled you are using the new window renderer, which uses more of the gfx card instead of cpu than the old one, and gives every window it's own drawing buffer, greatly reducing required CPU power for UI drawing (and increasing RAM requirements, btw).

I recommend giving the user you use to log in full access rights to the folder where you installed Ryzom, so the updates are written directly to the installation directory instead of the virtual personal program files override directory.

Re: Vista
 

No need; several months testing vista at home and work. I know it *very* good. Much more stable, and more secure for final user.

And the eyecandy; only if you like it.

BTW, as Riveit says, the restrictions are a fake. Some people have to learn what means "trusted computing" and another things...

And yes, this is a big off-topic

Re: Vista
 

Talk about dragging things way off topic... just answer the man.

Yes it can work under vista.

Re: Vista
 

Thank you :)

Re: Vista
 

kaetemi, mithur, i suggest reading this: http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut00...ista_cost.html

regarding the eye candy: first off, it decreases usability by using up valuable screen estate, some of us are still using 10x7.
secondly, great, it uses the gfx card, but tell me, why the heck would i want my gfx card in high power mode all the time? my power bill is big enough each month.
lastly, i have 2 gb of ram and i still am short all the time, why the heck should i want something that wastes even more of it?

Re: Vista
 

They have make great improvements in enegry saving modes, being the ACPI 2.0 and some of the 3.0 highly updated.
Vista takes less energy. BTW, all the work your GFX is doing with the desktop, is work that your CPU isn't doing; being the GFX best suited for this work, it takes less energy to do.

Windows vs. Linux, and older and bitter figth than Kara vs. Kami :P

Re: Vista
 

Not really, I use windows but I'm still not getting Vista anytime soon :p

Re: Vista
 

as far as i am aware neither the cpu nor the gfx have *smooth* power settings and can only switch between "idle" and "high" states. usually the gfx card sucks more power when in high mode and usually cpus switch into high mode already when they go above 2% usage, so it won't matter much wether it has less to do.

acpi and such is nice, but aren't those for things like standby, hibernation, etc. etc. as such totally irrelevant to power consumption in normal running mode. :)

and uh, no linux vs. windows debate here, i don't have linux on any of my comps. i am only comparing xp vs. vista and wondering wether it's worth shelling out ANY money at all. ;)

Re: Vista
 

That seems to be about HDMI really, not Vista. And to get those 'restrictions', your content needs to be 'protected' first, so where's the problem? Just dont get protected content, you can easily get unprotected stuff at the same and higher quality.

Re: Vista
 

the problem is:
unprotected or not is irrelevant. if windows thinks the content is premium, i.e. high quality, it will downgrade it if the hardware does not fit vista's idea of drm-compliant. funnily enough downgrading does not work and it will simply refuse to work.
a friend of mine who is musician has already run into this problem. she has a lot of quite expensive sound processing hardware that simply refuses to work if she uses it to process sound data of production quality. the kicker: the "premium content" is copyright to her, as such vista shouldn't meddle there at all, but it thinks it's "premium", sees the hardware doesn't offer encryption interfaces and goes: "not with me".

Re: Vista
 

Hmmm... ACPI is much more than that. There aren't only two modes of consume, but many more. And many modes of performance, in GFX and CPU. Can see some info here.

In fact, that's one of the main advantages of DX10. The Unified Arquitecture DX10 requires (Not dedicated hardware for every task, such as texturing, shaders, etc..., but one hardware for all task) makes that energy saving could be greatly advantage. My GFX has 96 steam processors; if the Graphics I'm running requiere full potency, the 96 will be working; but if I'm running Half-Life 1, only a few will be doing the work. (I have a GeForce 8800 GTS).

i.e.: when I run Halflife my GFX is almost 10º lower then when I run Half-Life 2 :)

Re: Vista
 

Works ok.
The driver version checking on ryzom launch can be annoying as it asks you to update your drivers every time for ATI cards to do different vista versioning.
On some cards alt-tabbing causes texture issues too - but alt-tabbing is not 100% on XP either.

Re: Vista
 

Content are bytes. If you open your content with an application, it only reads bytes. Windows does nothing with those bytes, the application does. Therefore, it means that your content itself has certain protection features enabled, and the application which reads your content takes care of that. Use open and unprotected file formats, always works. Don't use encryption, you're only locking yourself out. Disable your firewall, if you're not running anything behind your ports, they can't be attacked anyway. Never any problems!
Windows can at most disable features of your hardware, if they are not designed according to the specifications.

Re: Vista
 

actually, the os does a LOT with the data. the media renderer is an integral part of windows, the codecs are essentially virtual hardware drivers and the rest of the software between the applications and the devices consists of os-controlled hardware drivers. in effect a video player is not much more than a fancy remote control for the operating system's media facilities...
and at last, this is not a hypothetical situation. the friend i spoke about is now experiencing vista refusing to let her access devices that worked perfectly fine under xp, because it doesn't like to run high-quality media data to non-compliant hardware. (and no, she is not using wma oO, we're talking basic PCM here.)

Re: Vista
 

just remember kids, DRM is for our protection (from ourselves presumably) o_o

xp actually has a similar ability to nerf content playback but it was never really used. seems bill caved in or encouraged enforcement in Vista though..

Re: Vista
 

Some media applications use the Windows Media subsystem. Others don't do. Try with VNC, it uses his own codes; so no problems there.

Only if you go through the Windows media subsytem can windows deny reproduction of some HQ formats. So, it's easy, use another thing. Anyway, the people who wants HQ content being reproduced don't use WM, but another different and more specific systems.

Re: Vista
 

Vista has better security features than XP, which makes it very suitable for the average user with little PC and online security knowledge. It does also have some genuinely nice features, the "glass"/3D UI being one of them.

However, it is a new OS. New Microsoft Operating Systems need a year to mature, in general - and a service pack. For example, driver support for many essential devices is still in beta or just not present, which means poor stability.

Also (and it's a great shame), Vista for some reason wastes a large proportion of system resources on some seriously complex DRM and the flashy new UI. To be fair, the DRM only kicks in when you're playing "premium content" - and that can be anything from a HD-DVD or Blu-ray movie, right down to a music track or youtube movie being streamed from a website.

To anyone underestimating the DRM capabilities of Vista, you are mistaken. Anything deemed to be "premium content" is protected by the OS, not an application or a particular hardware device. Someone mentioned it was just HDMI in an earlier post - HDMI is maybe 10% of the DRM on a Vista machine, if that - HDMI's pretty much just a way for a video processor to securely ask a display "are you a HDMI-compliant display?". In the case of a movie, it's even down to the level of encrypting data as it leaves the disc drive and decrypting it when it gets to the video processor. And after that, the video card must check that the display meets a particular DRM standard - if it doesn't, the picture is downsized and made fuzzy before being transmitted to the display. Illustrated here - sound is affected in a similar way.

At the time of writing, it is impossible to legally play any "premium content" at full quality on a Vista machine with commercially available hardware!


In my opinion if you got Vista with a new PC then great, use it. But unless you really really need a particular aspect of it, do not pay for an upgrade 'cos you're getting a fancy front end and a few security features which can be substituted with common sense and security knowledge. It has no real benefit to a knowledgeable PC user, and the license agreement is more restrictive than ever (pray that you never need to reformat or change a CPU/motherboard) - the majority of its features were designed to make it marketable to Joe Average walking into PC World and buying a brand-name computer. A clue for anyone wondering: the people who know about computers aren't buying Vista.

Anyone who wants to read more about what Microsoft didn't advertise in their huge "the wow" marketing campaign, I suggest you read this. It's a lengthy and rather technical read but it will truly show you that there is no way around the Vista DRM. The technology itself is actually an impressively secure system, but it really should have been left to a dedicated media playback device rather than a PC OS.


To answer the OP's question - it works, but probably slower and there's no guarantee that all your hardware will work reliably under Vista unless your PC was sold as a unit with Vista pre-installed. Worst case scenario, Vista can shut down your video or audio hardware even if you're not doing anything wrong.

One last thing for the people doubting the truth of all this - the (extremely knowledgeable and trustworthy) computer and security experts who have brought this to light did so by reading Microsoft's own documentation which is freely available on their website. Just because you don't understand something doesn't mean it isn't there.

PS: Hi I'm Rigsta I just got the game, hope to see some of you in-game and have some fun ;)
(Edited for accuracy)

Re: Vista
 

Do you use Vista? I do, and I've seen nothing of that DRM stuff all you people talk about. At least not here. And it even runs faster than XP, just uses a bit more ram, but the RAM prices just went down in january, didn't they? You can buy it now then anyway, before they go up again in a few weeks.
Just so you know, I'm using a pc that's somewhere around 4 years old, with an almost 2 year old graphics card. My monitor (a simple 1280x1024 TFT) is connected with a good old VGA cable. I can watch any 'premium' content here that I want, without problems. Because it does not contain protection. The OS can not decide those things, unless you use protected formats. End of my story.

Read it yourself, that article is about HDMI/HDCP, not Vista. Just check how many times each word appears in the text.

Re: Vista
 

.. and you screwed if you just bough brand new HD ready _big_ LCD (non HDCP like most currently are) and you PC is running Vista ;-)

Re: Vista
 

How big should I need then for that?

Re: Vista
 

read the article.

Re: Vista
 

On the other hand just like with windows 2000 when windows XP became the main microsoft OS in use most of the nasty stuff will target the new OS and ignore the old.

Re: Vista
 

Hmmm yes, so what does that have to do with Vista? My movies certainly aren't in the HD-DVD or Blu-Ray format anyway. Let's see... you give me proof of your problems with a non-drm format, and I believe you people, ok?

It's like all that paranoia about how evil XP SP2 was, and that you shouldn't install it; well, I didn't really notice anything bad about it that restricted anything I did. Just that silly security control panel, but if you're smart enough, you'll notice that you could turn everything off, including the warnings. Well, because of that I don't believe anything about your Vista paranoia. Use it, give me proof of your problems with non-drm formats (you people said it happens with any format, so prove it), and only then I'll believe you. Until then, I'll just have fun with my current Vista Ultimate installation.


And somewhere near the end the article says... Well, they don't.