ok had a mess about with ring last night and was mildly overawed by all the stuff (kinkoo vs kara = kinkoo win btw)
one of the reasons I scrapped my semi hard work was it basically looked a little iffy, I tried to fence off an area near a hill and a total lack of the ability to angle the fences mean it just got buried in the scenery. for all purposes it would have acted as a barrier I know, but it still looked crap
I will play about some more when I am bored,