Can we play too ?

[calel]

Originally Posted by totnkopf

Phat lewt is already in game in the form of NPC armors. Thats about as far as I'd like to see it go. The encyclopedia rewards have shown great potential so far (except that lame +5 map marker one...... ) we just need more of them and allow the existing ones to be upgraded.

Bingo!

As to the remark of taking them out completely... as long as Nevrax keeps their word on the future implementation as on the Feedback forum, they ought to be a challenge for guilds and the scarcity won't affect crafters, so as far as I'm concerned they can stay to add challenge and some more flavor, but I don't see a need to add more.

A remark to Thool (elvigy1) on the need of relatively high level of hp:
Not necessarily; it's perfectly feasable to have 100 hp only to gather the better materials. Both solo and teamed. In the case of soloing you'll need luck and some basic evasive skill, yes, and suck up the DP in the case you falter and mess up big time.

But ... Atys and the way ecosystems, material-mob relations and the skillsets itself work, are all linked to one another. They were meant to be more than challenging for single characters; you'd need to function as a team to reap the best benefits. Fighters/mages would escort and protect foragers to the dangerous locations and keep it clear of any dangers, animal or homin; these foragers would gather the materials and hand these to crafters so these in turn could supply the fighters/mages with adequate gear. The materials looted from the slain animals would be compatible with the foraged materials, since, generaly speaking, you need both foraged and looted materials to compensate for the item's statistics.
It's all a visious circle really.

Ofcourse that only works when you have your mind set to social interaction and working as a team.

Now if only I could remember what I was trying to point out ...

[riveit]

Originally Posted by totnkopf

For loot thats "better than anything anyone can craft" (its not really... only the +hp/stam stats are btw... rest is average)

The last I checked, +4 parry and +4 dodge were impossible to craft (+7 even more so ). Is that no longer the case?

[totnkopf]

Originally Posted by riveit

The last I checked, +4 parry and +4 dodge were impossible to craft (+7 even more so ). Is that no longer the case?

+3 is the max on crafted HA, but that extra +1 parry makes little difference in a duel. I had forgotten about the parry tbh, but makes little difference. You may be able to make it using the OP boost tools, just never actually tried

If you're in dodge mode while in Aen, I laugh at you.

[d1sco123]

Originally Posted by mugendo

All opinions are fine with me, My original post is expressing concern for the folk who 'might' subscribe if 'positive' feature x/y/z is implemented, and 'negative' feature a/b/c is removed.
I want the EXISTING playerbase to decide what what is positive and negative.

Clearly not all opinions are fine to you, because you think that the existing players have the only opinions that matter. Sounds to me like you want the existing players to be the only ones that Nevrax thinks about. There are two flaws in this strategy, one from a business sense, one from a gamplay perspective.

The first, GLARINGLY obvious flaw in your strategy (that existing players' opinions should be the only opinions that matter) is that Nevrax will never get new players if our opinions don't count for something. The fact is that Nevrax, like every other company in the world, has to make money. Assuming that nothing ever changes in the game, and it's left as it is right now, Nevrax will make more money than they did a year ago, because they're getting new players. Now, if a year from now they have to decide to change things to add even more players, and they don't, they'll be losing out on potential revenue. Follow me on this, cause it gets tricky after this part. Without that extra revenue, how do you expect Nevrax to stay in business?

The second flaw in your strategy is that new players bring more than just revenue to a game. They bring more community, more opportunity, more perspectives. Sometimes, when one stares at something for too long, one tends to "gloss over" the things one doesn't really want to see. Having new players in the game brings new vision to old problems and methodology, which can lead to fixes older players may have "glossed over."

My only other issue with this post is that it's essentially turned into a "Go Away Noobs!" thread, which is just destructive to the game as a whole. If you consider yourself to be so involved and concerned with the wellfare of the game, you wouldn't want to be destructive to the community would you?

[katriell]

The second flaw in your strategy is that new players bring more than just revenue to a game. They bring more community

More community = worse community. Inevitable fact of population increase.

I am sorry if mine is perceived as an elitist or cynical viewpoint. It is merely the product of my observations.

[d1sco123]

As a new player, I respect the knowledge and effort that went into making this community what it is, and I seek to participate. Maybe I'm the sole example here, but I'm an example of a new player that will be a good addition to the community (assuming I don't get tossed out on my ear before I have a chance to participate). So enough of the "new players are bad because they hurt the community." It's an opinion, and you're entitled to it, but it's just plain insulting to those of us that actually try.

As an aside, there's a difference between "noob" and "froob." If you seek to label all noobs as being bad for the community, you're mistaken. It's the froobs that would destroy it. Of course, Nevrax thought of this and put them all on a nice deserted island so they don't have to get in the way of the noobs and the vets.

[grimjim]

Originally Posted by d1sco123

As an aside, there's a difference between "noob" and "froob." If you seek to label all noobs as being bad for the community, you're mistaken. It's the froobs that would destroy it. Of course, Nevrax thought of this and put them all on a nice deserted island so they don't have to get in the way of the noobs and the vets.

This isn't what's being said.
What's being said is that a larger community is, by sheer virtue of being larger, more impersonal, less welcoming and worse - because a larger community inevitably includes more bad apples.

The problem with MMORPGs is that a single bad apple can negatively impact the worth of the game for a larger number of people. Examples include but are not limited to...

* Crashing RP events
* Running up on stage during live events and dancing naked in front of important NPCs
* Kill stealing
* Mount/Packer slaying
* Non consensual PvP
* Immersion-breaking character names
* bad language/behaviour over chat channels

And so forth.

Its not saying 'noobs are bad' just that lots of people inevitably = worse community.

[d1sco123]

Thank you for your response, Grimjim, it has reminded me that the feeling I've been getting from this thread really had nothing to do with the point of the thread in the first place. I've moved my questions about the community at large into a new thread which I hope helps to explain a little better about how I feel about this issue. And yes, I realize that the more people that play the game the more bad people will play the game too. But doesn't that mean that it's worth it to cultivate the good players and make them great? Besides, the Ruins of Silan do a lot to seperate the good players from the bad ones.

But enough derailing, if anyone feels like reading my rambling, my thread is up on the board somewhere. And if anyone needs me for anything, I'll be in-game working on figuring out how to make ranged combat viable. :P

[mugendo]

Originally Posted by d1sco123

Clearly not all opinions are fine to you, because you think that the existing players have the only opinions that matter. Sounds to me like you want the existing players to be the only ones that Nevrax thinks about. There are two flaws in this strategy, one from a business sense, one from a gamplay perspective.

Have you actually read my original post ?.....If you have difficulty interpreting it I suggest skipping to the summary I put at the bottom for Nexrax.
You comment on the strategy I presented...Well I did not realise my original post was presenting a 'strategy', I was under the impression when writing it I was expressing concern (hence the use of the word "nervous" in the original post).

Originally Posted by d1sco123

The first, GLARINGLY obvious flaw in your strategy (that existing players' opinions should be the only opinions that matter) is that Nevrax will never get new players if our opinions don't count for something. The fact is that Nevrax, like every other company in the world, has to make money. Assuming that nothing ever changes in the game, and it's left as it is right now, Nevrax will make more money than they did a year ago, because they're getting new players. Now, if a year from now they have to decide to change things to add even more players, and they don't, they'll be losing out on potential revenue. Follow me on this, cause it gets tricky after this part. Without that extra revenue, how do you expect Nevrax to stay in business?

If you read into the thread you will see my comment regarding the Nevrax salary...To save looking I will recap...of course my response is as tricky as the Quandry we are presented with, so I will write it slowly for you..ready ?
"NEVRAX IS A BUSINESS WHOSE PRODUCT I WILL USE FOR AS LONG AS IT CATERS TO MY NEEDS/DESIRES/WISHES"....(which again,my original post makes reference/inference to)

Originally Posted by d1sco123

The second flaw in your strategy is that new players bring more than just revenue to a game. They bring more community, more opportunity, more perspectives. Sometimes, when one stares at something for too long, one tends to "gloss over" the things one doesn't really want to see. Having new players in the game brings new vision to old problems and methodology, which can lead to fixes older players may have "glossed over."

You are correct that new players can (and often do) bring new insight and enthusiasm to any project...and they are a breath of air I welcome with open arms. For my concerns......again, read my original post.

Originally Posted by d1sco123

My only other issue with this post is that it's essentially turned into a "Go Away Noobs!" thread, which is just destructive to the game as a whole. If you consider yourself to be so involved and concerned with the wellfare of the game, you wouldn't want to be destructive to the community would you?

I have a wish to see Ryzom remain unique and see this thread expressing the desire to stop the "griefers/whiners/visiting" players from directing the game development/direction...You can agree with this can't you?

edit..oops, I almost forgot "Welcome to Ryzom"

[micrix]

*no i wont comment*
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Bah... screw it. You know disco, those guys seem to work all from the same handbook of gnomish game dissvelopment. They are just blind. And SOE and Nevrax are no exeptions.

Look at SOE, they are masters in fixing stuff that isnt broken. Lately they fixed the running animation of the female toons. Some Ryzom veterans may understand what i am talking about Haha WTF... While some races cant *walk* properly, those guys fix the running !! And i know a couple of female players who are embarassed. Cause they made them run like chicks and not like female warriors. Made them run like they think 14 year old idiots want them to run. F*ck off immersion... while in the asian expansion the birds start to sing when sun rises.

Look at the latest adventure pack of EQ2. Developed by an asian team... its just perfect. Maybe those asians didnt attend the brainwashing gnomish DEVCON's in the western world and where not able to read those brainless whitepapers about MMO's.

So back to teh *BIG* uber team of developers. They guys who maintain WoW. Because its all about the incredible success of WoW. Everyone i know playing WoW, and i know quite a number, plays undead toons. Because they are *sick* of Michal Jackson like dancing elfes. No Blizzard, thats *not* funny !! Funny was when i met a prostitute in stromhold.. but that was a player and not a coded development. Hehe, which leads us back to roleplay and what MMO is really about... people and posibilities to have fun ingame...

Have fun everybody !!!