Production: Proposed crafting changes

[flat75]

To propose something for improving the chances of master crafter:
There could be a "precision crafting" stanza (lv250 skill needed to buy) which doubles crafting time and cost in focus for increased chance of success, for example +10% or +15%

Right now difference is negligible between lvl241 craft and lvl250 craft, i should be much greater.

[mugendo]

Though I don't understand enough about crafting to make any useful contribution to this thread I am pleased that 'percieved' flaws in the system are being 'Improved'.

[jamela]

Overall, sound like pretty good ideas for changes to me, and I guess destruction of materials is a little part of GameForge's fix to the economy. Then I read that partial successes will only degrade in ql.

I never much liked the silly successes of overcrafting, but this now seems even sillier: level 140 pants crafter, at level 101 vests, will now have a 90% chance of crafting q120-q150 vests - without any degrade of the attributes, 10% chance of failure risking loss of half the materials. Doesn't seem right.

[ffxjosh]

As the crafting changes are put in 'now in test' and the range as 'in dev' does that mean we will see these changes before we see range modded?

[Marjo]

Yes, the crafting changes will come first. You will also be able to test them very soon on the ATS.

[riveit]

Originally Posted by Marjo

It has, however, a serious flaw in its current state, which some of you already noticed. The bug we found gives you 20% chances of getting a partial success when you craft an item lower or equal to your level (the bug converts the 10% chances of failure into partial success, what was not supposed to be). That's why a level 250 crafter doesn't always look like he's mastering his skill...

After reading this additional explanation, I like the proposed changes. However, the only reservation that I have is the overcrafting for useful items will become too easy. For example a Master HA crafter with a level 101 in LA will be able to easily overcraft q250-q200 LA. I think that the degrade quality should drop to 20% below the skill level being used to craft, rather than the quality of the item attempted.

[xtarsia]

Originally Posted by riveit

After reading this additional explanation, I like the proposed changes. However, the only reservation that I have is the overcrafting for useful items will become too easy. For example a Master HA crafter with a level 101 in LA will be able to easily overcraft q250-q200 LA. I think that the degrade quality should drop to 20% below the skill level being used to craft, rather than the quality of the item attempted.

While i am still leveling my main craft, and realised the MASSIVE bonus this would give, ie master amp craft and u can craft ANY weapon garanteed Q200+ and it be useable, so it would be a HUGE bonus to me..

but, I agree with riveit, such a bonus shouldnt be possable. 20% below the level used.

[danlufan]

cant wait to test this out on the ATS, and im nearly master jewler so hopefully this will help :P

[dnycran]

I think you should fix the things that are really broken, instead of tampering with things that more or less work ok for most people (which may easily backfire).

What is broken with the craft system? It's the same thing that's broken everywhere in the game. The random number generator that you use is a piece of crap (excuse my language, but that's just what it is).

Personally, I've seen 8 failures in a row followed by 6 degrades at 70% chance of success, using up a whole day worth of digging to produce a handful of junk. On other occasions, I've been producing 6 items with 5% chance of success and not a single failure.
The chance to have 8 failures in a row at 70% chance (not counting the 6 degrades) is about 1:15,000, the chance to produce 6 items at 5% is 1:64 million.
Heck, am I one lucky guy, I should really play lotto!

Ask any level 250 mage who gets 3-4 resists in a row on a level 20 gingo. Ask any level 250 meleer who gets hit 3-4 times while still missing the same gingo. Ask any serious crafter how ill-balanced success/failure rates are.

Nobody would mind if things like this happened once in a life time. After all, we're talking of chances here, and even rare constellations can happen --- rarely.
However, the like events are no exceptions, they are (almost) the rule.
There is nothing wrong with ruining one out of 20 items, and there is nothing wrong with being hit by a gingo once in a week. However, if the probabilities are so grossly distorted as they are now, it is really annoying.

Fix the random number generator, and you have fixed much more than only the crafting system. A lot of people will be a lot happier, and you get a significantly more enjoyable game experience with less work.
Maybe you also want to consider that idea of a "precision crafting" stanza for master crafters. It sounds like a good idea, as it really gives significance to "master", and it would be a good reward for a new encyclopedia rite, too.

[fadebait]

Originally Posted by dnycran

Fix the random number generator, and you have fixed much more than only the crafting system. A lot of people will be a lot happier, and you get a significantly more enjoyable game experience with less work.

Yes, I agree that the current random number generator is abysmal. But I'm not sure how easy it is to fix, as computers are incapable of producing a truely random number, and most of the mathematical tricks i can think of to make a 'false' random number generator less prone to long runs of the same result would require a lot of cpu time when applied to an entire shard