Conflict

[danolt]

With almost 200 people showing up for Friday nights fight, it is safe to say that OP battles are not unpopular. Right at this moment, I feel that we have a chance to shift the feel of the game. We can move away from stagnation and the developing caste system (which may already be entrenched) towards a more dynamic community.

I am very concerned about the ability of new guilds to create their own niche, because we, as players, will simply not allow them an opportunity to find their own way.

Obviously, I am going to be blasted for being associated with the all powerful, dictatorial KA. But the truth is we have no charter, no rules, no votes and no requirements for OP battle participation, nothing that even approaches a governmental structure that is even tribal in level. We are hardly an empire. What we are is a group of guilds that share the common belief that Ma-Duk must be defeated.

I believe that a character, a guild, and especially an alliance need a definable and actionable purpose. Ryzom offers us something that can be higher then grinding everyone to max levels and boss hunts. Players can choose to impact more then just factionalized zones of control. They can even contribute more then just role playing narcissistic bald guys. There is a very real and growing culture on Atys. The difference between the races goes well beyond graphics. Atys has something I thought impossible, functional in-character religious faiths.

Preparing for the struggle against the Kitin is not an action; it is an excuse to keep things the same. When I hear people (not the characters they play) say we should not fight with each other, I think of snoopy from the peanuts cartoon. Snoopy would take naps on top of his dog house just in case the red baron attacks. He fought an enemy that came only when he was asleep. Can you imagine Starship Troopers or Armor if all the humans had gotten along with each other?

While I enjoyed the Kitin invasion, it did little to advance the Perosonality of my character. It had little to no impact on our guild or alliance. The impacts it did have were arguably negative as people dealt with the near impossible task of dividing guardian titles. Most importantly, as players, we have zero control over getting the Kitin to come out and play with us.

This game has so much untapped depth. Epic stories are based on conflict and they end in resolution. I would argue that too many players are trying to skip the body of our story and go straight to the happily ever after ending.

The battle scheduled for tonight, will those two hours impact the culture of Atys? I think so. It is a no win scenario for pretty much everyone involved. That is story. That is character development. That is why I play.


The moment I knew that I was in this game for the long haul is when I got completely blindsided and politically raped by the events associated with AA’s first battle declaration. We as players can help shape the future but our characters certainly do not have control of it.

There is always the chance that all the OP’s could end up being owned by one faction, but for how long? The stresses of conflict can break the strongest bonds. Compromise is easy when it costs nothing.

Raynes desire to bring some much needed definition to the Kami cause could certainly benefit from the Karavan reacting to him. In turn the Karavan benefit from Raynes contributing to the Atys experience. How many people benefit from an individual grinding plants for twenty hours a week? How many people have met friends and grown new relationships as they face the prospect of an OP attack?

New players are discovering Ryzom. Open war will not only help define everyone’s characters it will certainly change the status quo. Conflict is story.

Like it or not we have basically been playing the neutral version of Ryzom.

Let’s open up the Saga so everyone can play.

Pero

[tigrus]

Really nice post pero.



And one way to do it is, GUILD VS GUILD OP fights.
Id have one once a week or every second week

[raynes]

I'm happy to see that people do indeed see why I do the things I do, instead of me just being a mean player.

I would like to see neutrals take more of a stand on in game politics and less on game mechanics. How?

Well I'm a Kami Extremist. Why hasn't a player attempted to contact me to setup some sort of roleplay ring session? Or why haven't they contacted me to stage them stopping me from killing a tribe.

I mean really think about it. It would make really good RP if I went to kill the green seeds, but when I approached the camp, 20 players stepped up to block the way. They wear me down and the green seed take me out. They never fight, yet make a huge political statement about stopping me.
(and I won't do this now, because it now lacks the shock value).

The point is that neutrals should be using their beliefs to make the game more exciting, not more of the same.

[mugendo]

Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war !!


nice post Pero.


edit - I don't regard you as a mean player raynes, in fact you are are in the situation I was in when I played swg, and I know it's not an easy place to be.

[calel]

Under the current state of the game I'd have to say: impossible.

As players controlling our characters, guilds, factions we have as is little to zero impact on Atys and the storyline. Ryzom lacks consequences, real possibilities to influence the course of the story, no means to alter the gameworld even though we want to believe we can.

Faction vs Faction, Outposts, Kitin and Marauder threats, Cult and Civilisation allegiance, Governmental elections/scheming/succession, Rites and missions, Kitin lairs and stocks, Guilds, .... what tangible impact have all these things had on the story, the Saga? There's only been (very) few examples, few events that actually 'changed' a thing and had a story-driven impact.

The Temple Wars left us with temples, the kitin invasion 2 years ago cut off accessibility of towns to a degree, the opening of the Fyros-Zoraï portal, both the reappearance of the Guild of Elias and the Rangers of Atys (so far no impact yet due to these on gamemechanics or ingame presence save the Ranger camp on Silan) and different Tryker governors on the shards. Other than that, what influences have we had on the story? What else have we changed on Atys?

What does an FvF raid on Yrkanis or Dyron change for the story?
What do Outposts change storywise? What is their effect on Atys beyond the metagaming benefits?
Why haven't the kitin or Marauder attacks gotten an ingame impact, consequences? (save the one invasion from 2 years ago)
What's the purpose of being alligned with a power or culture? Does it change anything at all to the world or story if I make a pledge of allegiance?
Why again do we have different races? So we can have different stories on inbred kidnapped princes and discussions on which type of wood sinks fastest. (I'm not dissing the event team her; they as well have to row with the oars they' ve gotten)
Governmental elections ... well at least the lore page got updated.

One by one examples of things that COULD mean/have meant something but there's been no consequences, no progression on story or world.

If only it were possible to have PvP combat affect your fame and thus influence reactions of npc's (minor first, then major), possibly driving up government/cult tensions to new highs. What if Outposts had been more nationalistic flavored and the Leaders would care; wouldn't that possibly bring forth racial conflicts, automatically changing or progressing the story? If we were to loose our access to towns and whole regions because of an invasion, they'd certainly be a threat and provide conflict. Ah well, plenty more where those came from.

But none of this matters, it just keeps us occupied; none of it is possible, it ain't present.

[katriell]

The players ARE the saga. What individuals, guilds, alliances, and factions do IS the politics. That is my opinion on the matter. I am not interested in big flashy changes so much as the subtle ripples as people and circumstances change and shift.

[calel]

Originally Posted by katriell

The players ARE the saga. What individuals, guilds, alliances, and factions do IS the politics.

Player politics only bring forth more player politics. Without official backing or ingame content they can't and won't change anything.

The Fyros players could for instance pretend to declare war on the Matis, but without the official backing or acknowledgment of the governments it would never become real lore or part of the story.

[danolt]

Are you actually arguing that OP battles have no effect on Atys? Are you saying when Infinity left the game it did not change the story? That the two alliances have no meaning?

Epics are about how people react to great events. They are not about the actual event. It is what characters do in the face of uncontrollable circumstances that makes the story eternal.

Perhaps that is why some folks are neutral, they want control. I myself prefer that we have a part in the story. I don't think we should be the story. Can you imagine how screwed up this game would be if players controlled the factions and racial governments? That is just scarey.

Pero

[raven41]

I like OPs, They could use alittle work, Like more buildings and maybe a new use... But I don't think they need a change in the way they are attacked, However, they DO need a way to trade them diplomaticly, Without battle...

I Would MUCH rather see OPs added to and made better then Spires being released =p Maybe open a few more OPs sometime

[ruslan]

Originally Posted by danolt

Can you imagine how screwed up this game would be if players controlled the factions and racial governments? That is just scarey.

For me, that's exactly what a "sandbox" game should aspire be. This would really be our characters making history. Nothing scary in this - anyone from the days of MUDs can tell you how well it can work - and I believe that the company brave enough to put these capabilities into a game will have the greatest MMORPG imaginable on their hands